Dispatches

Comments

1. As a 18 year old female I have to say I was appalled with programme and its potrayal of young black males. Even though I was shocked by some of the views of this young males (particularly one of the boys from Barking) however with this being said I was also very proud of his friend for challenging the views held by his peers. And like many of the other comments have stated gang rape is a UNIVERSAL and NOT A BLACK PROBLEM!! If we as black people hold these views ourselves we are not helping the problem and are just trying to find someone else to blame but ourselves as a society. This also doesn't help to resolve the issue and just pushed the problem around in circles. Stephen Griffins shocked me because he simply agreed with the views of the journalist. What I found most annoying was the way Mr Samura kept emphasising if it was a black problem when it clearly is not. The views he held appeared to be very bias and this caused me to read further about the programme and found he now choose to restrict his children to a curfew because of the views expressed. I do understand as a parent you have to try and protect your children but you wrapping them in cotton wool is not going to help the problem disappear!! We need to work out a way to address the problem as a SOCIETY instead of blaming different ETHNIC GROUPS particularly BLACK PEOPLE!!

   Posted by G.A. on 19/07/2009 22:31:57

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2. If women committed these sorts of horrendous crimes against men, the world would be a very different place, I guarantee you. It would not be tolerated. Women are and always have been treated as second class citizens - or less than. What angered and continues to anger me most, is the absolute lack of justice. Rape is not a crime, except on paper, because a law is meaningless with nothing to enforce it. Victims are neither taken seriously nor protected by the authorities, and the conviction rate is lower than one percent. So where is the deterrent for rape? Even on those rarest of instances when there is a conviction, the unduly lenient sentences are a further insult and cause for anguish for the victims. Why do men rape? Ultimately because they CAN. There is no deterrent, there is no justice. Women need to do something to stop this. Not live in fear hoping it won't happen to them, and then suffering in silence when it does. TOGETHER, not being ashamed in isolation, women need to show their anger to bring about CHANGE. Women, and and those men who are against rape, need to act together to show ZERO TOLERANCE.

   Posted by Lilly on 30/06/2009 20:19:45

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3. This was a chilling documentary but a very courageous piece of journalism nonetheless. I wondered where these young men had learnt this behaviour and how they had developed their own peculiar code of justification;is there anything in their life experience? At times,listening to them, I was reminded of the traumatic violence witnessed and often experienced by young refugees. It is shameful that adults now provide so little moral guidance to the young and that there are no activities provided to support positive role models. In the Uk the generations are too often segregated; youngsters left with only their peers for guidance will ineveitably develop anti-social behaviour. I wanted to ask them if they would be happy for their sisters to be treated this way and whether they would be happy for their future children to learn of their actions ?

   Posted by Lesley Basu on 25/06/2009 20:50:07

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4. After watching this programme on Monday i was appalled at the portrayal of young black men as the predominant cause of gang rapes. I think young black males are always being used as a scapegoat when there is a problem and gang rape is not just a problem for the black community, it is a universal problem so why should this group be stigmatised. I also feel that the young men used in this documentary failed to represent the majority of young black males, who would not even consider participating in a rape. My brothers were offended watching this programme and i feel that Stephen Griffiths may be in the wrong line of work becasue he clearly has a biased opinion of black youth. Yes i did acknowledge what the young men were saying and their misguided views on young females and sexual relationships but the issue has surpassed the stage where it calls for change in a single community.

   Posted by T.W. on 25/06/2009 16:32:42

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5. I am very troubled by this programme. After watching it I was somewhat overwhelmed by the failure of our communities on so many levels. All the young people in the programme are the product of a number of unmended fences. Dysfunctional families, excessive liberalism among adults, authorities etc, poverty; both morally and financially, the subliminal messages of an individualistic and materialistic community, fear, cowardice, self image based on completely erroneous reference points, the list goes on. I think we need to accept that on the whole, children don't raise themselves, they are quite simply a mirror of the environment in which they grow up. As ugly as it is, we must first look at ourselves as adults. One can almost liken some of their behaviour to viruses that have mutated and become resistant to conventional treatments. There are many adults in our society for instance who believe that casual sex after a night out is fine between two consenting adults for instance. In the event of the risk of an unwanted pregnancy, morning after pills. We call this modern living, the antithesis of the repressive 50s. My point is that we will struggle to address the issues of the young whilst we as adults live unbridled lives. I agree that to simplify matters down to music and gangs is to sidestep fundamental issues. The very fabric of these young men and women has been corrupted and they honestly do not know right from wrong. But wagging the finger alone or putting them in prison alone is not going to change the tide. We as adults must reclaim the moral authority to be their teachers and to discipline them or resign ourselves to living in fear of them. This will not be achieved by telling them right from wrong alone but principally by modelling it. Now of course I am speaking generally here, not suggesting that every last adult is irresponsible or without a moral compass but in general, adults too have questions to answer since the harvest is a reflection of the seed, soil and the gardener's effort and oversight. The only real question at this point is ‘what am I going to do?’ We must all ask that of ourselves; individually. Only then will collective efforts be meaningful and build meaningful momentum. If the answer to that question on an individual basis is ‘nothing’ then I and by extension we, can look forward to further mutations and ultimately a state of siege in the not too distant future.

   Posted by R A on 25/06/2009 14:25:39

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6. Very disturbing, but sadly it comes as no surprise to me. Many people have never heard of juvenile sex offenders, yet as evidenced by this programme, they do exist. The slant seemed to be more about gang-related offenders, yet there are many young individuals who commit sex offences. Adolescent sex offenders don't just abuse their peers; they may attack adults or pre-pubescent children as well. I'm not advertising Facebook, but there is a new group called 'Survivors of Juvenile Sex Offenders' which may be of interest to those affected by such abuse. There is very little targetted support for those affected by the actions of juvenile sex offenders, and this group appears to be the only one on FB. (For the benfit of anyone who may wish to join this group, can moderators please leave this paragraph in, thank you). I fear it is too late to stop the decline of society. There are many decent people, young and old alike, but sadly, the tide seems to have irreversably turned at their expense. We are now in the third and fourth generation of such a decline. What can be done to stop this from continuing given the lack of power victims and concerned people have these days? Truely depressing.

   Posted by jso-aware on 25/06/2009 02:01:45

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7. Like CB i can't get this programme out of my mind and feel so outraged by the views of these young men and the way the young girl claimed she had set up other girls to be gang raped for sleeping with her boyfriend, words cannot describe what i felt when i heard her say that! Just think how many young girls this may have happend too, who have not told anyone and who are suffering in silence. I would like to know how the young men feel after hearing what the victims have gone through(if they saw the programme)feel now and if they feel ashamed by what they said. The reason that these young girls don't report these horrific crimes is because of FEAR, they don't feel protected and know that some of these gangs will come after them and risk being stabbed, raped again or some other extreme form of brutality. If adults are scared to step in when they see this thug mentality going on, then is it a wonder that the young girls don't report these brutal crimes? To be honest it's not about the rap music it's about where you live and how "Hard" you are. Some of these men are of the view that they are untouchable and that they can do anything to you, remember its not easy to move away from an estate so some youths feel that its better to join these gangs and be "protected" than not. Also like CB said alot of these young men have been subjected to the worst kinds of violence and many are surrounded by others who have a sick mindset and have no ambition. We all have to come together now and help to stop this behavior even if it means going into these estates and trying to talk to these young men about their view points and behaviours, maybe showing them that some people can't have children after being rapped or the physical and mental abuse that these women endure for the rest of their lifes. I know their will be some men that you can't change but there are some that do and will change.

   Posted by VERY UPSET BY WHAT I SAW on 24/06/2009 14:33:50

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8. Thank you for making such a hard hitting documentary about a very disturbing and deeply distressing subject matter. I think that the girls you spoke to in the film showed a staggering amount of dignity and courage by coming forward to tell their stories.As long as the perpetrators feel that they can intimidate and bully victims into keeping silent, these crimes will continue to go unpunished and get more severe in their nature. Victim protection and support has to be at the heart of breaking this pattern of violence. We must do more to protect young victims and restore people's faith in the criminal justice system that these boys will be brought to justice.

   Posted by CB on 23/06/2009 20:23:09

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9. I too watched the program last night and just wanted to say how brave I thought those girls were who came forward and were prepared to talk to Sorious about their ordeals. They have suffered a traumatic experience that could potentially affect the rest of their lives. The girls who spoke out about their ordeals were incredibly brave and intelligent in knowing that by telling their story they might encourage more young girls in a similar situation to come forward or ask for help. I wish I could have been as brave as these young women were, when I was their age, and spoke out against my attacker. It just goes to show if these few girls were able to speak out. How many more girls are out there who have had this happen and have left their attack un-reported. The government and the legal justice system need to do more about the issue of rape starting with changing peoples attitudes to having more support services and more education within our schools on the issues of rape. Just hope something can be learned from this and it is not just swept under the carpet as is what usually seems to happen.

   Posted by Isis on 23/06/2009 13:56:11

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10. I was deeply disturbed by this programme, but not for the reasons that other viewers seem to be. Sadly, the programme was an hour long, decontextualised continuation of the demonisation of 'black culture' and young black males in all it's technicolour glory! I despair. Group rape is not simply a 'black male' issue (although it is one now!); it is a male issue. It is also an issue for ALL in our society. The programme made no attempt to discuss the social issues that create the conditions for these types of crimes to occur; namely the continual perpetuation of partiarchal discourses on male and female sexuality! We live in a society that repeatedly sexualises the female body and constructs women as 'sex objects' and constructs men as dominators and as 'violence objects'. The programme failed to situate it's spurious findings within the wider debate on rape in the UK. Put simply, the rape statistics show that the majority of rapes are committed by lone offenders. Duo's make up the next largest category (at a considerably smaller proportion) with rapes committed by 3 or more perpetrators being very rare indeed. In addition, women are more likely to be raped by partners or ex-partners and by men who are known to them rather than strangers. This programme featured cases that fit the mould of a 'real rape' i.e. 'actions perpetrated by a group of men who select a random victim and engage in gratitous violence against her. This hedious crime is not commonplace and is not the prediliction of or 'a rite of passage for' [all] black males! When will the viewing public cease to believe that the information given in programmes such as these are 'the facts' and an accurate account of this phenomenon?

    Posted by Tracy on 23/06/2009 13:52:36

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11. More inspirational, strong good black men such as Sorius Samura getting out there and exposing us to what goes on. Many people are unaware that gang rape even happens, never mind on the scale that was shown in this documentary. As a white female, I was raped throughout my childhood by a member of my family.I carry the physical, emotional and psychological difficulties put on me by going through what I did. I am absolutely shocked to think people can quite literally walk on by, turning the other cheek while anyone is raped...but adolescant female children, by a combination of boys and men? Adults who do not intervene are basically saying that rape is OK....it`d be very different if it happened to them or their own though, would`nt it? Or, is gang rape seen as acceptable behaviour not only by the young men, but also by the adults supposed to be responsible for them? Girls, not women are setting up other girls to be raped - that is disgusting. Boys, from what was on that documentary seem to see it as a rite of passage. No. RAPISTS AND CHILD SEX OFFENDERS (Which any of these boys over 16 who rapes an under 16 year old are) why are WE, as a society allowing this to happen? Once again, I commend the wonderful Sorious Samura for his thought provoking documentary.

    Posted by Just_a_Girl on 23/06/2009 11:33:38

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12. The rot amongst our young men not only blacks reflects what has been brewing for years in our society. Young men/women have been taught by our society that Values, Self Respect and Respecting others does not matter from the examples they see in our society. This has a major impact in their thinking and behaviour. Our local and cenral government would always talk around the issues but never take action and when they do take action, they bring in so called experts who would spend much resource and time without dealing with the underlining issues. Young boys and girls who grow up in our nurseries, primary and our local communities are not given boundaries and are not taught that for every action there is a consequence, they become young men/ women of tommorrow. Some years back, I sent my children abroad because of what I saw as a system where children cannot be correct. Recent examples with the Bankers and our MP'S also reflects to these young men/women that you can do what you like and get away with it. A saying from my backgound say" A butterfly goes through various stages of growth, if it misses one stage, it becomes an incomplete butterfly". Our young men/women need to go through the proper stages growing up for society to begin to reverse these henious consequences.

    Posted by mo on 23/06/2009 11:32:46

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13. Thank you channel 4 and I also hope there will be a follow up programme. I started watching the programme alone but after the first victim, I called my teenage twins boy/girl down to watch with me. We actually got into quite a heated discussion as in some occasions because it goes on and some girls get themselves bad reputations it is as mentioned in the show inevitable that they would get raped. I was saddened and heart broken at our young peoples attitude to each other, they show no natural love and I wonder is this because they lack this and believe that sex replaces it. As another person commented it would be interesting to see what the parents of the rapists thought. I shared my thoughts with my children very openly yesterday and believe that as with the increasing incidents of knife crime we should have open debates like Eddie Nesta and Richard Blackwood have been involved with discussing this. Most parents have an idea from the news what is going on, but never guessed it would be to this extent. Through God's blessed grace and genuine love may this situation improve soon.

    Posted by Maria on 23/06/2009 11:21:37

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14. I have no understanding of inner city life, gangs or the like and this programme was a shocking eye opener. Not an enjoyable programme but a challenging one. I do hope that Channel 4, and indeed other channels, employ Sorious Samura increasingly. I found his presentational abilities easy to understand and first class. Well done Channel 4 for airing this programme and for putting the licence fee subsidised stations (BBC et al) in the shadows.

    Posted by Michael on 23/06/2009 11:09:33

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15. THANK YOU for high lighting a subject few are prepared to acknowledge. Although on a low income I feel passsionate about being part of the solutuion and spent a fair amount of cash putting together a booklet, leaflet and display of posters from the Men of Strength website. This is an organisation working towards educating young men and women about respectful relationships (non abusive)and redefining true masculinity not the Rambo style, or macho womanising predator. In tandem the Armed services are taking onboard the problem of sexual assault and rape within the ranks and working alongside Men of Strength providing workshops for males and females. Regretably the British Government's almost invisible anti rape Campaign was abysmal. Their posters'in the worst possible taste' and placed on condom machines, in mens toilets and male magazines. Individuals are unique not all women or men want to be sexually active, the women prepared to bare their all in girlie mags or porn fims DO NOT represent all women. It is my belief the prolification and availability of porn has warped the ideas of those who use them. I hate to think males view me in the same way they view women who profit from, frankley letting all womankind down. Thank you again and for the opportunity to have a say. Cheers,peace and blessings to one and all Rita

    Posted by Mrs Rita Mulvaney on 23/06/2009 10:45:10

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16. Although very disturbing it was also a huge eye opener as to how, what seems like, the majority of young black men/boys see rape. Thankfully though there was one young man last night who actually disagreed with his friends (a group from Barking) which no one has picked up on. These are the kind of young men that we need to show more of. The whole show was put in an extremely bad light and it would have been good to have seen a few more positive role models like that young man from Barking who didn't feel the need to play up to the camera, who didn't crumble to peer pressure and who was strong enough and confident enough to stand up to his so called friends. I am a mixed race 27 year old man who has been brought up by my mother and the rest of the women in my family as my father couldn't be bothered stick around, i have a long term partner but most of all i have complete respect and admiration for all the women in my life. How someone could even begin to think about justifying rape is beyond any logical thought whatsoever. Hurting a woman physically and scaring her mentally for what would probably be the rest of her life is just barbaric and inhumane. These young men need serious punishment, not a pathetic prison sentence so that they can brag to their friends about being some nut case criminal when all they are is a rapist, they need real hard punishment so that these women can have some form of justice and hopefully teach these vermin a lesson. It disgusted me how some of these young boys were so disrespectful towards women/girls, there were no morals or decency applied to what they were saying just sheer brutality and mindless actions brought on by nothing more than peer pressure, lack of self control and complete disregard for that word "RESPECT" Again i salute that young man from Barking who had the courage to disagree with his friends and not give in to peer pressure, we need more young men like you. Darrell (a very proud older brother, good on ya bro)

    Posted by Darrell on 23/06/2009 09:46:50

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17. At long last someone from the Black Community has brought out the heinous and cruel crimes young black people are subjecting each other to, thinking it is funny and cool. However where are the Parents to these individuals who has incriminated themselves and peers of their cruel activities. It would be even better to hear what their parents comments. how can they not know what their children are doing, no matter how sweet they behave in the home as a parent you have to be a fly on the wall. Well done Sir you have done a wonderful job, by showing Black people who has their head in the sand what is happening in today's society.

    Posted by sandarita on 23/06/2009 09:33:29

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18. What a great programme and well done to Mr Sorious Samura for handling such a sensative issue with great insight and frankness.He showed just how misguided young men are today in their attitudes to women and sex in general. What was so shocking was how most of the men interviewed actually didn't realise what is considered rape. He didn't pull any punches and went to the source of the matter. The revelation that young girls were also "setting up" revenge ambush attacks resulting in rapes designed to teach other young girls a lesson was just mind boggling and again showed just how well Samura done in winning over their trust. As Samura point out, the Black community is over represented in these statistics and their attitudes are being shaped by a lack of parenting, easy access to pornography and music that legitimises violence and explicit sex as badges of honour and status. The real silver bullet of the show was the results. The interviews with the victims and their families was the real heart of this show and showed the devestation and pain caused by such mindless violence. I only wished that the show also included the parents of these "Rapists", as we all wanted to see these parents brought to account and explain to the whole world how they raised such children ? This programme was a credit to dispatches and i hope that they make a follo up programme and get this issue higher on the political agenda. Bravo Channel 4 and Mr Sorious Samura.

    Posted by Hugh on 23/06/2009 08:36:49

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19. I spoke to my little (14yr old) sister after watching this documentary. She enlightened me by casually explaining that she knows of situations involving kids at her own school, where gangs of 'girls' have attacked boys and carried out what I can only describe as gang sexual assaults on them. I shall be having a further and very in conversation with her on this subject. I am really quite scared by what might be revealed.

    Posted by Concerned on 23/06/2009 02:38:20

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20. I have been reduced to tears from watching this programme and feel compelled to do somthing to help these young women. The worst thing is the humiliation these young women have to endure because these barbaric thugs film them and boast about these horrendous crimes! It's so sad to know that many of these young girls don't even report it or get medical assistance because they live in fear! These young black men who feel this is appropriate behavior are sick, i am angry that they feel no emotion or have any respect for women, they should ask themselves how would they feel if it where their mother, sister or female relative that had been hurt in this way. This behavior is WRONG full stop and their parents should instil the values that we all try to instil in our children on how to behave. I know not all black men behave like this, my brother who is currently at uni feels just as appalled by this and is also angry and before anyone plays the race card, i am a black female who was put in a simular situation when i was in my teens, i'm now 30. The only way we can stop this is if you speak up i no it's not easy but we can't allow anymore of this to happen!

    Posted by VERY UPSET BY WHAT I SAW! on 22/06/2009 23:15:38

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21. i thought it was discusting how some of those black boys because they are not men, were condoning gang rape and how they didn't know that some of the things they were doing was classified as rape. How sick can some people get i was so angry and sickened by some of the "boys" reponses saying that women bring it on themselves. Why is it that just because women have so many sexual partners that the deserve to be raped; and that if men have many partners its fine its scary to know that this is happening in the city i live in

    Posted by anon on 22/06/2009 22:52:20

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22. Very disturbing documentary - what is to be done? As a woman I have spent what seems like a lifetime marching against rape. Perhaps boys and men ( as shocked by this programme) Black and white need to organise their own male only march against rape to show that they distance themselves from rapists?

    Posted by Step up on 22/06/2009 22:32:36

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23. After having watched and been very diturbed by this programme i felt compelled to post something. nearly 10 years ago i was in this situation and believed it was a one off, but to learn that it has almost become a rite of passage for young black men i am very disturbed! For any young woman going through the trauma, please speak up, it took me 2 years before i informed anybody and nearly destroyed my life and well being. i certainly didn't ask for it like the young men in this programme stated, i trusted my boyfriend who then broke my trust, along with his two friends. only by coming forward will you overcome the mental trauma and be able to move on and be succesful.

    Posted by annonymous on 22/06/2009 21:12:43

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24. It is an absolute disgrace the way that these young men and boys feel about women and young girls, do they not have mothers or sisters, my god how would they feel if it happened to a member of their family. I have never been so angry watching a documentary as I am watching this, have they no respect for others or pride in themselves. I feel sorry for this generation as they mature what will life hold for them will they always treat others like this.

    Posted by Tabatha Coleman on 22/06/2009 20:42:19

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